If Patrick had thoroughly read all of my blogs and website (or done some more research as he suggests), he would have seen that I have done just that. I have had dogs from childhood and earned my living from them for over thirty years. And not just one type. I trained and worked my Police Dogs including both patrol dogs and drug detection. and in my role as a ‘Dog Listener’ I have dealt with hundreds of breeds and problems. These range from the ‘usual’ behaviour issues that people like to stereotype certain breeds with to the more unusual such as a Chihuahua who acted like a homicidal maniac and the large Bull Breed’ that was frightened of everything. And every kind of behaviour in between. They have all been dealt with successfully without recourse to having to hurt them.

It’s only a slight pinch says Patrick. That’s ok then, you only hurt your dog ‘a little bit’. Perhaps the next time you want your child’s attention you should pinch them (but only a little bit).

“It only takes a slight pinch and the dog looks to me for direction”. I would suggest that when the dog looks at you his thought process is more along the lines of, “You bastard! What did you do that for? I’m trying my best and you keep hurting me.” What is wrong with mutual respect, showing the dog what is required without resorting to physical punishment however mild?

Patrick says that I am biased and he is right.I make no apology for it. Having seen these cruel, and I do mean cruel, gadgets, in action over a large period of years, including by, in fact particularly by ‘informed trainers’. Nothing will convince me that there is any benefit in their use other than to the companies that manufacture them or the trainers who find it easier to follow the ‘Do what I want or I will hurt you’ school of thought because it’s so much easier than understanding the dog isn’t it?.

I’m sure Patrick is a dog lover and doesn’t WANT to hurt his dog. No doubt he was told to ‘be a man’ or ‘take no crap’ from his dog. I do urge him to sit down and analyse what he is doing to his dog and how the dog perceives what’s going on. Leave machismo, testosterone and ‘what the other guys might say’ out of the equation and I’m sure that he’ll reach the right conclusion and allow his dog to come to peace.

If you’re worried that not being hard on the dog will make him soft then click on the following links. The first one shows ‘heelwork’ with a young dog and the second ‘manwork’ or biting, with the same animal at age 9/10 months. Read the text before viewing the clips so that you know what you’re are seeing. these clips along with others are available elsewhere on this blog, I’ve just put them here for ease of access

http://www.robinglover.com/blog/2007/07/police-dog-training-heelwork-and.html

http://www.robinglover.com/blog/2007/09/police-dog-training-5-manwork-biting.html

It never matters what the dog does. It’s what we do to rectify it that makes the difference between stressed or happy dogs and owners

The part that you are right about is that most training aids in the hands of the wrong person can be dangerous to the pet. This includes the prong collar. You highly exaggerate, however, the fact that an informed trainer can use this with little to no force, and clearly communicate to the dog.

Properly used, this is probably one of the most humane ways to train a dog. Communication with my dog takes a slight flick of the finger. The prong collar delivers a slight pinch, and the dog looks to me for direction. He has learned fast, that I am in control, and he needs to pay attention to the pack leader. It never took a hard jerk, and the dog never yelped. He enjoys his walks more than ever. You are biased and uninformed on the correct use of the prong collar. Do some more research.

If this equipment is not inherently cruel then why are manufacturers and users so coy about what it is called? On introduction they were called ‘Spike or Spiked’ collars and then when people were put off by the name the name mutated to ‘Pinch’ collar ‘German’ training collar and of course ‘Prong’ collar. No matter what you call it, the equipment, intent and result is the same. Do you think you’d be allowed to use this on convicted criminals? Amnesty International and your local Civil Rights groups would be up in arms.

Some people justify the use of such equipment by saying that damage caused by ‘choke chains’ being as bad as spiked collars. Even here there is wordplay, the correct word the manufacturers would say is ‘check chain’. As you know if put on one way (check) it releases at once and if put on the other way (choke) it locks when pulled reducing the dogs airflow and potentially suffocating them. Just saying that a choke chain is also cruel no justification it’s like asking someone if they’d prefer to be shot or stabbed. There is no need to use either of these pieces of equipment to train your dog. It can be done easier, quicker, more kindly and efficiently with either a slip lead or conventional collar and lead.

Many people out there use these collars (and electric shock ones) not because they are bad people, they are dog lovers, but because they have been badly advised to by ‘experts’ who conveniently have them for sale. The owner has a problem goes to a ‘trainer’ who tells them that this is the way to go. Any concerns of cruelty are brushed aside. Take the collar off your dog and examine it, move it slowly and see the dynamics and mechanics of it. as I mentioned one of its names is ‘pinch’ collar. As the lead is pulled the spikes close and pinch areas of flesh around the neck area as well as digging into the neck and throat tissue. If it didn’t hurt it wouldn’t work in fact it doesn’t work even then because the dog is only obedient because he doesn’t want pain. Imagine working for a boss who said “Do what I want or I will hurt you.” Would you do your best for him? Of course not. How about using it on your children? How long would it be before Social Services took them off you and placed them in care?

I do not base my opinion on the ‘Barbaric’ look of the equipment but on evidence. I served as a Police Officer for 35 years all in front line policing on elite units including Special Patrol Group at Scotland Yard. Everything I did had to be evidence based. And the evidence of my own eyes, seeing this equipment used in a variety of scenarios, talking to vets, by seeing the results of it on animals seized after being brutalised and traumatised by ‘ owners or trainers’ and by the sheer distress of both owners and dogs who come to me having been through the hands of people who advocate these methods, and see that it has their dog being at best, confused as to his role. To be able to turn these dogs around and see fire in their belly and light in their eyes again is a wonderful feeling.

Many of the worst offenders are the trainers who take dogs away from their owners and return them ‘trained’. Why don’t they want the owner present during the training? Surely that would better? At least every couple of months I get call from someone who has used such a facility and whose dog is now stressed and nervous particularly if touced around the neck area, responses range from aggression to shaking and involuntary urination and in almost every case included in the ‘continuation training pack’ which the owner buys is one of these collars. Often the owner will also get a sales pitch to buy an electric shock collar for ‘advanced training’ you can’t beat technology, now you can traumatise your dog at a distance.

Do a bit of research have a good look at website and blog you’ll see I’m not a tree hugging pinko lefty as one respondent called me (Well they were selling electric collars). If you decide that you would like to truly understand your dogs with no gadgets or compulsion then try Amichien Bonding there are qualified Dog Listeners all over the world
As I said at the beginning I’m not out to upset anyone except that hardcore of people who are intentionally cruel to their animals. My aim is to educate and get dog owners to say “Perhaps there is another way.” Don’t forget everytime you use any form of force or compulsion on your dog you suffer stress as well. You don’t say what you do for a living but if you’re in a stressfull occupation that won’t help your well being. owning a dog should be a joy and relaxing.

Keep safe.

Oh and even the consultation with Jan Fennell did not cost $1000′s!!

Fiona

Because I am against hurting animals I am a ‘Namby Pamby’ another indication that he has no idea of my background. There are a lot of criminals both in and out of prison who wouldn’t recognise that description of me. Have a look at the ‘Police Dog Training’ clips on this blog and you’ll see that you can have a highly trained powerful police dog without having to brutalise either the dog or yourself.

In the earlier post Justice decided that I charged $500 now only a few minutes later he’s upped my prices to $3000 no wonder the US economy is in freefall if people like ‘Justice’ are running it.

I’ll say it again I’m in England not the U.S.A.

‘Justice’ has not read very much of my website or blog or he would know that I don’t whisper in dogs ears. I am a ‘Dog Listener’ not a Dog Whisperer. I use the Amichien Bonding method of Canine Communication as devised by Jan Fennell perhaps he’d like to read the post ‘Why use Amichien Bonding?’ on this blog.

‘Justice’ has a Chocolate Labrador that ‘wiggles into his torture collar’ yeah right!

The arguments to justify (NOW I know why he calls himself ‘Justice’) start to unravel at this point. He claims that he only had to use it ‘about’ 3 times. So how many times was it? 3? 4? 5? 6? Surely you remember how many times in using this equipment on your dog you said to him “Do what I want or I will hurt you, a lot.”

‘Justice’ says that it is wrong to equate the human arm with a canine neck and of course he’s right. The arm doesn’t have a windpipe or spine close to the surface and so will have no affect on the humans breathing when applied to the arm. Put it around a dogs neck and the spikes will cause stress, pain and injury to the dog. that is the whole point in having large spikes that gouge into the skin and then close up and trap and pinch large areas of loose skin. Once again it’s “Do what I want or I will hurt you.” Please don’t say that you don’t pull hard because I don’t believe it. I have seen too many of these being used and never with the ‘just a pull’ that you would have us believe worked for you.

You tell us ‘Justice’ that ‘these collars work, they work quick and then you put them away’. If that is so why do you then say later in your post how much your dog loves it when you put it on ‘just for drill’. But hang on that can’t be right can it? You’ve just said that you used three little tugs and then you put it away. Could it be that you still put this kit on your dog when not needed? It wouldn’t be to remind him that you still have the poweer to hurt him would it?

‘Justice’ is right about a number of things though . Dogs do yelp or scream when in pain and when a spiked collar is used on them they WILL suffer pain.

I do have a spike collar in my bag, also an electric collar and a riding crop to beat a dog to ‘teach respect’ All of thes were given to me by clients who were advised by ‘experts’ that they needed this kit to make progress with their dogs. The equipment is used to show people what we are talking about in our campaign to make all such devices illegal. I am sometimes ashamed to be a member of the human race when people justify cruelty.

Oh and I don’t charge $500 I’m British, Dammit!

“Why is your horse so well behaved?” Why do they seem to LOVE getting out and don’t want to run home?”

Well because they were trained right the first time and didn’t go through a bunch mamby pamby crap that worked if you talked just right. IF they displayed a dangerous behavior such as biting,kicking or rearing up—they were dealth with firmly and justly and NO harm came to them OR the rider IF they were not hurt on the first time around.

Try to talk a biting horse out of biting.
Nope– just get one of those little kiddy bats and wrap it with cloth and then–when the horse does his deeed. Babe Ruth right on the end of the nose and the wonderful animal will not hurt anyone anymore and he will be loved and get lots of attention becuase people won’t be afraid to handle him,
OR PAY YOU three thousand dollars and get results that work if you wear green everyday.
Look I know that YOU are probably on the up and up and I know an animal behavior specialist very well who is wonderful with cats and is WONDERFUL with all animals AND it just isn’t what you people portray it to be. This thing LOOKS terrible but have you ever checked out a BIT for a horse with tongs etc.

The Horses I trained ALWAYS graduated DOWN from a bit to a Hackamore and then did not live their whole lives with people Yanking on their mouths why>

Because the severe tool was used correctly and in a VERY timely manner and so it served its purpose and THEN it was DISCARDED forever FOR THAT ANIMAL.
IF someone is using this kind of collar on a dog for more than a few walks–then THEY are doing something wrong.
Sometimes YOUNG powerful dogs have to have one of these used when they have not been exercised in days but just about two minutes with it– a couple of PROPERLY timed tugs NOT YANKS! and the dog remembers that pulling is not OK.

This is a useful tool for teaching an animal that it is NOT the boss.

Not all of us can afford the dog whisperer.

Give me a break.